Comments on: Want To Go To The Stars? Hop On Board One Of These Spacecraft… http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/ Sun, 14 Mar 2010 23:22:36 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Weirdwarp - Moving the Earth Out Of the Way of That Big Bad Sun http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/comment-page-1/#comment-5754 Weirdwarp - Moving the Earth Out Of the Way of That Big Bad Sun Wed, 02 Dec 2009 11:08:45 +0000 http://www.weirdwarp.com/?p=1996#comment-5754 [...] idea is a free-floating solar sail at a point near the Earth where the pressure of solar radiation balances the Earth’s [...] [...] idea is a free-floating solar sail at a point near the Earth where the pressure of solar radiation balances the Earth’s [...]

]]> By: Chris Dann http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/comment-page-1/#comment-5726 Chris Dann Tue, 01 Dec 2009 10:46:47 +0000 http://www.weirdwarp.com/?p=1996#comment-5726 Agreed, perhaps the large Hadron Collider will give those new discoveries. Agreed, perhaps the large Hadron Collider will give those new discoveries.

]]> By: James Smith João Pessoa, Brazil http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/comment-page-1/#comment-5695 James Smith João Pessoa, Brazil Mon, 30 Nov 2009 21:53:19 +0000 http://www.weirdwarp.com/?p=1996#comment-5695 But there are almost certainly undiscovered possibilities that will change everything. A great example of this is a piece I read by Richard Bach (Jonathan Livingston Seagull, Illusions) who wrote that the ancient Egyptians could fly. Obviously, we know that they did not. They left us so many records in the form of drawings and writings that we would know if they had. But, they had bamboo, papyrus, linen, and the thermals and steady winds of the Nile valley. They could have built gliders capable of sailing hundreds of miles. Unfortunately, they were ignorant of the laws of aerodynamics even though they were as much in effect then as now. But they didn't know, so they didn't go. It's likely that there are laws of physics that we don't know about today that, if we did, we would be capable of feats as astounding to us as flying would have been to the Pharaohs, who would have assumed it was supernatural. But there are almost certainly undiscovered possibilities that will change everything.

A great example of this is a piece I read by Richard Bach (Jonathan Livingston Seagull, Illusions) who wrote that the ancient Egyptians could fly. Obviously, we know that they did not. They left us so many records in the form of drawings and writings that we would know if they had.

But, they had bamboo, papyrus, linen, and the thermals and steady winds of the Nile valley. They could have built gliders capable of sailing hundreds of miles. Unfortunately, they were ignorant of the laws of aerodynamics even though they were as much in effect then as now. But they didn’t know, so they didn’t go.

It’s likely that there are laws of physics that we don’t know about today that, if we did, we would be capable of feats as astounding to us as flying would have been to the Pharaohs, who would have assumed it was supernatural.

]]> By: Chris Dann http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/comment-page-1/#comment-4738 Chris Dann Fri, 13 Nov 2009 10:09:10 +0000 http://www.weirdwarp.com/?p=1996#comment-4738 The sails could also be just a continuous cargo line to planet/moon/station taking food, oxygen, water etc. I love the idea of a recreational sail though. The sails could also be just a continuous cargo line to planet/moon/station taking food, oxygen, water etc. I love the idea of a recreational sail though.

]]> By: Roga http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/10/want-to-go-to-the-stars-hope-on-board-one-of-these-spacecraft/comment-page-1/#comment-4702 Roga Thu, 12 Nov 2009 18:29:23 +0000 http://www.weirdwarp.com/?p=1996#comment-4702 Good summary article. Few points: Alcubierre geometry seems to be the best chance for FTL. However, it may still violate causality - but that's not necessarily a showstopper, it's just weird. And you have to travel slower than light the first time, to "pave the highway" as it were for future passengers. Magsails and M2P2 are not useful on our end, but they are extremely, insanely useful for interstellar relativistic travel, because they are very effective drag brakes. Rockets or solar sails or Orions would not have to carry deceleration propellant with a magsail, they can just turn the sail on around the other star's heliopause and coast in, keeping a reasonable G load on the occupants the whole way. Since the rocket equation is exponential, this allows you to cut your mass to the square root. I too see a big role for solar and magsails in a romantic analog of the high seas. I don't know if they will ever fully replicate the glory of clipper ships by carrying cargo and commerce around the solar system - fusion rockets are just too near-term and too appealing an opportuniy - but solar and mag sail craft will be sportsmen's dreams. Imagine an inner-planets regatta, dropping from Earth to Mercury by antiorbital tacking, then a close sun pass to fly by Venus for a gravity assist to Mars! You'd be hard pressed to run that route even with a fusion rocket. Good summary article. Few points:

Alcubierre geometry seems to be the best chance for FTL. However, it may still violate causality – but that’s not necessarily a showstopper, it’s just weird. And you have to travel slower than light the first time, to “pave the highway” as it were for future passengers.

Magsails and M2P2 are not useful on our end, but they are extremely, insanely useful for interstellar relativistic travel, because they are very effective drag brakes. Rockets or solar sails or Orions would not have to carry deceleration propellant with a magsail, they can just turn the sail on around the other star’s heliopause and coast in, keeping a reasonable G load on the occupants the whole way. Since the rocket equation is exponential, this allows you to cut your mass to the square root.

I too see a big role for solar and magsails in a romantic analog of the high seas. I don’t know if they will ever fully replicate the glory of clipper ships by carrying cargo and commerce around the solar system – fusion rockets are just too near-term and too appealing an opportuniy – but solar and mag sail craft will be sportsmen’s dreams. Imagine an inner-planets regatta, dropping from Earth to Mercury by antiorbital tacking, then a close sun pass to fly by Venus for a gravity assist to Mars! You’d be hard pressed to run that route even with a fusion rocket.

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